Mark Ingram Wins the Heisman
by War Eagle Atlanta on Dec 13, 2009 6:42 PM CST
26 comments
The Auburn game not withstanding, Mark Ingram had a solid year for Alabama
Marking the third straight year for a sophomore winning the Heisman Trophy, Alabama's Mark Ingramtakes CFB's top honor in the closest balloting ever, beating out the 1985 race between Bo Jackson and Iowa's Chuck Long. Ingram received 227 first place votes, barely edging Stanford's Tony Gerhart's 222. Ingram's point total was 1304, and Gehart's 1276. Third place went to Texas' Colt McCoy, 4th to Nebraska's Ndamukong Suh and 5th to former Heisman winner, Florida's Tim Tebow.
Ingram's win marks the first time ever for a player from the university of Alabama to win the prestigious award, which is very strange considering Alabama's place in the annals of CFB and the number of great players to come through that program. "The legacy of Alabama football certainly had a void filled," Tide coach Nick Saban said.
Showing a predilection for winners, this year's award marks the sixth time out of the last seven that the trophy winner has gone on to play in the BCS championship game. Both Ingram and Tony Gerhart enjoyed a late surge of support, catching perrenial favorite Colt McCoy, who would have definitely been a candidate in the 'body of work' category. Ingram, in spite of not winning the SEC rushing crown, ultimately was deemed to be more of a MVP for the undefeated Tide, a scenario that may have been enough to push him past the candidate from 8-4 Stanford.
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Its a shame he won it.
And I say that with no dis-respect intended to Bama or Ingram.
Any argument for Ingram to win the Heisman is an insult to Bama. They are a very good football team, and that goes well beyond Ingram(whose definitley a special back). Trent Richardson would have been winning this award if Ingram had gotten hurt on the first play of the season. Ben Tate would have won this award if he was wearing Crimson instead of Orange and Blue.
My point is, when a guy wins this award and it can be argued that he isn’t even the best back in his conference, he shouldn’t be winning the Heisman.
I know I’ll get slammed by Bammers but I’m really just giving your team a compliment. Without Ingram they still go on to be undefeated and are still sitting here waiting to play Texas. Ingram is good, very very good, but I’m not so sure he seperated himself enough from the rest of the SEC pack of running backs, let alone the whole country.
War Eagle
No disrespect taken, and none intended...
But if he is not the best RB in the SEC, who was? If he was not the most influential player (offensively of course, because we all know that’s what the Heisman is all about) in getting his team where they are today, then who is?
Seriously, I’m not going to knock your answer, I’d just like to hear your opinion. I honestly don’t believe that Bama would be undefeated without Ingram’s performance this year. Richardson does not (yet) have the stamina or conditioning (in my opinion) to hand 75% of the carries. Not a single 18 year old with less than a year of collegiate strength and conditioning would; not even Richardson. He’ll get there, but it wasn’t going to be this year.
"There's a lot of blood, sweat, and guts between dreams and success" - Coach Bryant
ugh
First off, football is the ultimate team sport. So there is an inherent contradiction between the nature of the game and acknowledging individual accomplishment. It’s true that any Heisman winner owes a great deal to his teammates. But to say “it’s a shame [Ingram] won it.” is extremely unfair. Does Ingram rely on his teammates more so than any other back? I don’t think so. The Alabama O Line is smaller than it was last year and not as experienced. Only 1 lineman earned all SEC honors. Ingram’s yards after contact percentage was exceptional, which to me indicates that he is truly earning those yards.
it can be argued that he isn’t even the best back in his conference, he shouldn’t be winning the Heisman.
This is ridiculous. You can argue anything if you want. Ingram was statistically superior to everyone in the SEC. It’s not even close. If some other RB wants to be considered the best, then go out and prove it on the field. Don’t give me this BS about “well if they played for Alabama…”.
Without Ingram they still go on to be undefeated
There’s no way to know this. Did you watch the South Carolina game where he averaged over 10 yards per carry (over 250 total yards), where he carried the ball on every snap on the key scoring drive? How about the Kentucky game? LSU? Alabama would still be a great team, but how do you know that another back would have been able to carry this team all those times that Ingram did? Like most of your points, this statement is an unfair hypothetical and anridiculous assumption.
What you're seeing is team spirit. It's like the Holy Spirit, but more powerful.
-Hank Hill
IMO, Dexter McCluster is the best back in the league
It’s not his fault his coach is criminally insane and gives him 12 carries per game. Of course, Ingram trumps him in YPC, YPG, and TDs, so he really has no argument.
Excellent retort, Zoltar. FWIW, I’ve thought the Heisman to be a complete sham ever since Charles Woodson beat out Peyton Manning. I haven’t watched a minute of that ceremony since then.
Also, can anyone explain to me AT ALL why Tim Tebow was even invited?
You know what they call a quarter pounder with cheese in France?
by jd is legend on Dec 13, 2009 10:10 PM CST up reply actions
politics, ratings, sympathy? take your pick.
What you're seeing is team spirit. It's like the Holy Spirit, but more powerful.
-Hank Hill
Are you mad?
I think mark ingram is just an above average back. Trent Richardson will be far better. I think Toby gerhart got cheated big time. But props to ingram. Yards after contact is a misleading stat. If a o line man forces a bad angle but he touches ingram that counts towards it. So I watch clips and ignore that.
by auburn1125 on Dec 13, 2009 10:23 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Any stat can be misleading if you focus on a particular play. Goal line touchdown vs an 80 yarder. A tipped ball interception vs an overthrow. Etc, etc. But when you’re getting 55% of your 1800 yards come after contact, that gives you a pretty good idea that your RB is making things happen on his own account.
What you're seeing is team spirit. It's like the Holy Spirit, but more powerful.
-Hank Hill
Just a hint...don't argue statisitics
Then where does he stack up against the guy from Stanford?
Upon moving to AL, I let my wife decide who she would root for. After one day at a new job full of Bama fans, she met me at the door with a hearty cry of "WAR EAGLE"
by SandMountainTiger on Dec 13, 2009 10:51 PM CST up reply actions
He stacks up just fine.
Total yards: very similar.
Yards per carry: Ingram leads (6.2 vs 5.6)
Touchdowns: Gerhart leads (26 vs 18)
Worst game: very similar. Gerhart was held to 80 yards and 0 TD in a LOSS against 5-7 Wake Forest (85th rushing defense). You know about ingram.
But then you get into competition. Ingram faced 6 top 20 defenses and dominated. Gerhart’s toughest competition was four D’s ranked between 20th and 30th, though he posted similar numbers to Ingram.
http://www.rollbamaroll.com/2009/12/10/1194935/why-ingram-should-win-the-doak
Honestly I would probably give a slight edge stat wise to Gerhart, but I think Ingram’s performance against Florida in one of the biggest games in recent history was enough to make him worthy.
What you're seeing is team spirit. It's like the Holy Spirit, but more powerful.
-Hank Hill
Don't Waste Your Time On These Tools
Everyone in here is a Barnie. Of course they aren’t going to agree with common sense. For the record I think Bo Jackson was a joke for the Heisman. Why would you let a man who could not read win the Heisman. I know that might seem like a ridiculous argument, but so is every other argument written above. Just trying to fit in. And to consider Ben Tater for Heisman……………… Hahahahahahahahaha.
by whatsthatssmell on Dec 14, 2009 6:30 PM CST up reply actions
Ingram
Did not seperate himself above the rest of the SEC running backs enough, in my opinion, to be considered Heisman worthy. Argue all you want, until your face turns blue if you want, but you’ll never be able to argue that he was the clear cut best back in the SEC, let alone the whole country.
Did Ingram have a fantastic year? Of course.
Is Ingram a fantastic running back? Of course.
Was he more important to his team’s success, and carry his team on his back like the others? No.
He was the romantic pick by the sportswriters and voters and that’s all there is to it. I’m not taking anything away from what Ingram did this season, he had a great year, but I just don’t where he is more Heisman worthy than Gerhart or Suh or McCoy.
War Eagle
but you’ll never be able to argue that he was the clear cut best back in the SEC
statistically, he was the best by a long shot.
Was he more important to his team’s success, and carry his team on his back like the others? No
You only think that because he wasn’t a QB or on a mediocre team, and the Iron Bowl is clouding your judgment. If you look back at the stretch of games where Gmac didn’t play well, Ingram absolutely carried Alabama to wins.
What you're seeing is team spirit. It's like the Holy Spirit, but more powerful.
-Hank Hill
Hey, don't get me wrong. Ingram is one hell of a back.
Just think the voters once again went for the story over anything else. It happens just about every year. Grats to Ingram, he just wouldn’t have been my choice. Auburn made a lot of mediocre players look like superstars this year, and somehow, he wasn’t one of them.
Upon moving to AL, I let my wife decide who she would root for. After one day at a new job full of Bama fans, she met me at the door with a hearty cry of "WAR EAGLE"
by SandMountainTiger on Dec 14, 2009 2:53 AM CST reply actions
A major flaw in the Heisnman selection process is the judges’ bias that the candidate’s team needs to be winning, and popular. This is what killed Gerhart’s chances. Also, they rarely pick a defensive guy. It’s always quarterbacks and running backs, like offensive linemen are just watching the plays.
.
That being said, I’m happy for Ingram. He did what he was supposed to do. It’s the selection process that ticks me off.
My Take (should anyone care)
My view of the Heisman is that the player should define the team. What I mean by that is if the player is off the field the team is totally different. Could Bama have won the SEC without Ingram? I think so. Most people who watch SEC football would agree. Bama is loaded, and the RB position is stacked. As said before Richardson is a better back in my view and if he started it would be him invited to NY. When Ingram left the game, McElroy could just hand it to Richardson or Upchruch and it was basically the same.
You take Gerhart off the field and Stanford does not win 6 games, maybe not 4. Take Colt away from the Longhorns and they are not winning the BIG XII south, much less the BIG XII. The same can be said for Tebow, although his numbers were just average. He should not have even been invited. Suh is the game changer. Too Bad that he got no love. I did not watch any Nebraska game other that the Texas game. He is a stud. At least he got invited.
I am not trying to bash Ingram or Bama. As a matter of fact I think it is great that an SEC guy won it. Ingram had a great year for an unbelievable Tide team that will more than likely win the NC. Was it a Heisman deserving year?… I guess so, but maybe it is because there was no true standout. No one that was head and shoulders above the others.
If you are a War Damn Eagle, you can War Damn anything.
As said before Richardson is a better back in my view and if he started it would be him invited to NY. When Ingram left the game, McElroy could just hand it to Richardson or Upchruch and it was basically the same.
You take Gerhart off the field and Stanford does not win 6 games, maybe not 4. Take Colt away from the Longhorns and they are not winning the BIG XII south, much less the BIG XII. The same can be said for Tebow, although his numbers were just average.
And if you take Tony Pike away form Cincinatti… oh wait. That happened for a couple of games, and his backup did just as well. This is just a bogus analysis. You have no clue how good the people behind these players are, and even if you did you’re basing the Heisman on the quality of the second string players. How does that make sense? What you should be asking is if RIchardson played behind Gerhart, would Gerhart even crack 1500 total yards? I don’t think so.
What you're seeing is team spirit. It's like the Holy Spirit, but more powerful.
-Hank Hill
I agree Zach ...
….Congrats to Ingram, a deserving player but I believe all votes should be submitted before any conference playoff games. It is the only way to be fair to all. Also the Heisman should be renamed the Heisman-best offensive player award. Defenseive players need not apply.
aubtigerman
"The reason you come to Auburn is because of Auburn people.This is a special place, from the coaches all the way to the fans" - Andrew McCain OT
Thanks for the shoutout WEA
I’m sure Ingram’s a happy kid right about now. That’s really what it’s all about, anyway.
by HarveyBirdmanAAL on Dec 14, 2009 11:13 AM CST reply actions
He seems
like a good kid. Very humble and honest and a hell of an athlete. Good for you guys!
Auburn Tigers: The leap-frogging'ist bowl team in 2009.
by War Eagle Atlanta on Dec 14, 2009 12:00 PM CST up reply actions
ingram is a great back... but he didn't have the best year of all the candidates.
i like ingram as a runner. he runs really hard…especially like how he takes on tacklers. reminds me of an ol’ AU back#24…oh yeah, i remember his name… cadillac. :)
ingram stepped up in big games, but not the Iron Bowl. to not consider the Iron Bowl a big game is to completely ignore how close bama came to losing…it all. now, they find themselves playing for the NC. ingram was shut down completely against Auburn. the heisman shouldn’t go to someone who got replaced in the game for poor production…and outrushed by a 2nd stringer. sorry,… i just don’t get it. i just don’t agree with it at all…
the winner should have been gerhart.
i think the voters separate themselves from the numbers because they aren’t completely comparable…and this i understand. but toward the end, there was a lot of talk about how this could be bama’s 1st heisman… and the novelty of that may have really swayed the folk who couldn’t make up their minds…
it was an exciting heisman race… we shall see how ingram can fair against the Texas D…& gerhart against the Oklahoma D. there’s a story ahead…
wappa
thing to consider with the iron bowl.
I’m surprised y’all don’t realize this, but every time Ingram was on the field, Auburn zeroed in on him. They weren’t going to let him do a thing. When the whole defense is focused on him, it’s hard for him to do anything no matter how good he is. Like he said in his interview at the Heisman ceremony, no, his stats weren’t great, but he opened up the passing game. And then when Richardson came in, they didn’t focus on him as much which allowed him to perform better.
Ingram and Gerhart are apples and oranges
I watched Gerhart play, and Stanford ran him, it seemed, every play. Ingram was an every down back from time to time this year (The end of the South Carolina game is the best example), but not all year long. The reasons are obvious. First, Alabama has a decent passing game. Second, they have a great stable of backups.
Ingram ran at his best against ranked teams. He had a down game against Auburn, who, I believe, not only wanted to limit his production, but also to end his Heisman campaign. He also had two very limited games because of a minor knee injury early in the season.
Do I believe that most Heisman voters knew all this? No, I don’t. Anyone who reviews the list of Heisman winners over the last 20+ years can see that the winners come disproportionately from the best teams. Do I think that the Heisman truly honors the very best college football player in the country? Hardly. Remember, Alabama played against Gino Toretta. The Heisman is an award for the best offensive player on a three-loss or better team, with better than average stats, and a heavy slant toward quarterbacks.
"So I want everybody to think here for a second, how much does this game mean to you? 'Cause if it means something to you, you can't stand still. You understand? You play fast! You play strong! You go out there and dominate the man you're playing against, and you make his ass quit! That's our trademark! That's our M.O.... as a team! That's what people know us as!" - Coach Nick Saban before the 2008 LSU game.
by 12NationalChampionships on Dec 14, 2009 3:37 PM CST reply actions
I agree
that Ingram deserved it, but I also think Gerhart did as well. At the end of the day Ingram won. You can attribute it to a lot of thingsb, butI think it came down to 3:
1) Bama is playing for the NC and lately they love giving it to a player from a team in the NC game.
2) Ingram had the season he had in the SEC. It’s the toughest conference around and he stilled played as well as he did. Imagine his numbers in another conference.
3) (And I think this was a large factor) There was no representation from the Midwest or Northeast. Ingram is from Flint, Michigan so folks up that way who hadn’t seen all the games or didn’t have an interest in anyone from a regional team went with the kid from Michigan.
Again, I think he deserved to win, but for everyone who says they cant figure out how or why he won, there you have it…my 2 cents.
"Jay Jacobs can't go to the bathroom without Bobby Lowder's permission" - Paul Finebaum
by GumptownTiger on Dec 15, 2009 8:54 AM CST up reply actions
i didn't think he deserved it... but what a race it was.
..and what a gracious and humble acceptance speach ingram gave…
as i said,… i do think very highly of him. i was surprised how surprised he
seemed to win. i thought,.. even though the #s didn’t support him as the leading
candidate that most thought he would take the trophy going into the weekend.
wappa
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